Well, the "dialogue" has heated up between the Cessationists represented by the Strange Fire Conference and the Continuationists or Charismatics who were the subject of the Conference's denunciations.
MacArthur and other Conference speakers were careful to say there are true Christians in the Charismatic Movement, and also that by their blaspheming or insulting of the Holy Spirit he (MacArthur) didn't mean THE blasphemy of the Holy Spirit that Jesus said will not be forgiven, which he characterized as a stubborn hatred of Jesus Christ that he does not impute to the Charismatics; but some of the Charismatics aren't in a mood to be so generous to him, some classing HIM within the general apostasy we are witnessing today, accusing HIM of being the false teacher.
The Conference grounded all its objections on the Bible, very effectively in my opinion, yet some of the Charismatics come back accusing MacArthur and company of being unbiblical. Did they hear the arguments at all? They don't address them at all, choosing instead to highlight perhaps a conclusion someone drew without the evidence that backed it up. The Conference speakers concluded for instance that the Charismatic Movement is simply not Christian, meaning the movement itself, its doctrines, not all its members, having clearly said many times that there are Christians within the movement; but Charismatics insist that they condemned them ALL. Were they listening at all? It's easy to miss important points if you're perhaps disposed to pick up certain affronts to your beliefs and tune out the rest. Just a thought.
Besides insisting on certain miracles, many of the Charismatics simply miss the point that nobody at the Conference said the Holy Spirit has completely stopped working, but that He works through Providences rather than miracles, and many of the Charismatics confuse the two in their objections to the Conference. I many times pray for Biblical light on a particular subject and sometimes it comes to mind immediately. That's not a miracle, that's a Providence. Once years ago with Jehovah's Witnesses at the door I quickly prayed that God would show me what to say to them: "I will not give My glory to another" from Isaiah came immediately to mind, which gave me a terrific starting point for talking to them. Now THAT is Biblical, it HAD to be the Holy Spirit, but it was not a miracle, it was a providence.
Although I say I'm now a convinced Cessationist there still are some gray areas that concern me. I am completely convinced that the GIFTS of the Spirit to individuals have ceased, that no one can rightly claim to BE a prophet or a healer these days; but the Cessationists apparently have more in mind than that, that ALL miracles ceased after the apostolic age. [Later: Been listening to Pennington's talk again and he does say that God has done miracles since the apostolic age. I did have the impression from others that they don't agree with that]. I've been praying about it and the answers do seem to keep coming back that they DID cease. I ask about a particular phenomenon and something from scripture will come to mind that suggests it doesn't hold up to that standard. I'm still not sure about some miracles many I know claim to have witnessed, including among family members; but many personal experiences and "communications" such as I have experienced over the years have not been holding up.
Yet surely the Lord can and does occasionally still do miraculous healings and even other miracles. I think of brother Andrew back in the 50s who reported that God healed his war-shattered ankle at the moment he submitted to God's call to take Bibles into Communist and other nations hostile to Christianity. I think of Corrie Ten Boom in the Nazi concentration camp whose bottle of medicine never ran out although she kept dispensing it to other women in her barracks.
But I'm not sure the Cessationists DO mean to exclude ALL such claims. I've listened again to some of the talks and will keep listening but so far no clear light on this question.
In holding up some of my own past experiences to scrutiny over the last few days I've tried to be very strict with myself, "Do not spare, Lord, I want to know if I have been deceived." There is something very convincing about such experiences, such as a sense of receiving a communication about some situation one is going through, a sense of being guided in a certain direction perhaps. There is more I need to examine and I don't want to get into detail at this point, but as I say above the general result so far has been that they probably were not from the Lord. I say probably because some of them were VERY convincing and in no clear way contradicted anything Biblical either. SOME were shown to me in the Bible itself and those I'm not doubting.
Of course most Charismatics will claim to be grounded in the Bible, and wouldn't object to anything Steve Lawson said about Sola Scriptura, until he got into the Biblical interpretations of the Puritans and others who agreed that the gifts ceased at the end of the apostolic age.
BASED ON THE BIBLE.
I haven't yet heard Tom Pennington's talk again but want to soon, but still remember it as giving a very thorough BIBLICAL basis for the cessation of the gifts.
Thursday, October 24, 2013
Friday, October 18, 2013
A Few Things I Learned from the Strange Fire Conference
Finally, after many years of uncertainty, now after hearing the Strange Fire Conference over the last three days I can say I am a convinced Cessationist, that is, I am finally convinced that the supernatural gifts of the Spirit that were given to the apostles of Christ and many believers of the apostolic era as well, are no longer in operation among Christians. The speakers at the Conference all gave convincing Biblical, historical and other evidence for this position, and what a relief after so many years to finally have a settled view of this.
As I mentioned in the previous post, the talk by Tom Pennington on Day 2 was particularly eye-opening for me, as he thoroughly covered the Biblical examples of God's use of supernatural powers and miracles to authenticate His chosen spokesmen and His work, showing that there is no reason for us to have the same gifts as were needed to authenticate the mission of Christ and the founding of the Church as God's work. But I also have to say that ALL the talks worked together building one upon another to consolidate and confirm that understanding. I'm VERY grateful to John MacArthur and his team for putting on this Conference and I hope it will be as much of a blessing to many others as it has been for me. From what I've heard, they had a very good audience following the streamed video from around the world.
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The Conference is on You Tube now; it's a bit hard to find all the sessions in order but it can be done. You Tube also stops a lot on my computer so I may do better when they are able to get them posted on Grace's streaming video page again: http://www.tmstrangefire.org/
Also, the Sunday (October 20) service at Grace Community is going to be streamed at 10:30 AM PDT and MacArthur's message will continue the theme of the Conference. They expect a great number of the Conference attendees to be present along with the regular congregation.
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I just want to note a few things that I learned from the Conference:
90% of Charismatics around the world are Word-of-Faith or Prosperity Gospel believers, that is, those who follow the charlatans who promise health and wealth while fleecing the flock and living outrageously extravagant lives at the flock's expense, many of whom are extremely poor.
There is a music group called Jesus Culture that is apparently very popular with young people across all the denominations, whose hypnotic repeated phrases can serve as an enticement to Charismatic doctrine. They come out of Bethel Church in Redding, California, one of the wildest Charismatic churches these days, where the kind of phenomena seen in the "Toronto Blessing" and the "Brownsville Revival" are experienced. Video of both these phenomena and performances of Jesus Culture were shown at the Conference.
Pastor Conrad Mbewe of Zambia presented a sad picture of the biggest churches in Africa these days, which are charismatic churches, where the pastors are no longer preaching the word of God but behaving more like witch doctors and committing sexual sins with members of their churches, one pastor having fathered ten children by as many women in his church, and nobody condemns these practices. We often hear that great revivals are ongoing in Africa, apparently based on these very large congregations, but Pastor Mbewe made it unfortunately all too clear that if this is revival it certainly isn't CHRISTIAN revival but something pagan to the core.
Over and over it was demonstrated at this Conference that absolutely nothing good has come out of the Charismatic Movement, that the supernatural powers claimed always turn out to be bogus and that there is a very high incidence of immorality among the leaders. This ought to be apparent to those of us who have had experience of the movement, as so very very little of it is ever really convincing, it's mostly all rhetoric.
I think it was Steve Lawson who presented the information about the Puritans along with many others of the greats of the church through history as having specifically denounced the sort of claims to supernatural powers that are claimed by today's Charismatics, and specifically declared that the supernatural gifts had ceased. This I want to hear again.
I was also interested to hear John MacArthur denounce the Jesus Freaks of the 60s and 70s for changing the style of the churches. This included the change to casual dress and new music styles, both bringing the hippy culture into our standard Christian experience and laying the foundation for many of the excesses the Conference was exposing. I'm so used to hearing that the Jesus Freaks were an authentic revival, that stuffy and hidebound churches had missed this move of God that saved thousands (which did happen), that I simply hadn't given any thought to the cultural impact they had on the Church, which was NOT for the better. The general trend to trivializing and demeaning God and worship can be traced back to them.
Well, all that is off the top of my head and I may add to it later. I was educated, exhilarated and uplifted by everything about this Conference, it was extremely well done in every way I can think of, from the program to the music to the best streaming arrangement I've ever seen.
However, after the Conference I found myself in a discussion with a very pro-Charismatic friend who hadn't seen the Conference and didn't seem to think he needed to see it, but threw all the usual Charismatic arguments at me, even accusing me of the usual spiritual failures Charismatics generally accuse nonCharismatics of. I suppose that's to be expected and I also expect that the internet is going to be hopping with arguments about the Conference for some time to come.
As I mentioned in the previous post, the talk by Tom Pennington on Day 2 was particularly eye-opening for me, as he thoroughly covered the Biblical examples of God's use of supernatural powers and miracles to authenticate His chosen spokesmen and His work, showing that there is no reason for us to have the same gifts as were needed to authenticate the mission of Christ and the founding of the Church as God's work. But I also have to say that ALL the talks worked together building one upon another to consolidate and confirm that understanding. I'm VERY grateful to John MacArthur and his team for putting on this Conference and I hope it will be as much of a blessing to many others as it has been for me. From what I've heard, they had a very good audience following the streamed video from around the world.
********************************
The Conference is on You Tube now; it's a bit hard to find all the sessions in order but it can be done. You Tube also stops a lot on my computer so I may do better when they are able to get them posted on Grace's streaming video page again: http://www.tmstrangefire.org/
Also, the Sunday (October 20) service at Grace Community is going to be streamed at 10:30 AM PDT and MacArthur's message will continue the theme of the Conference. They expect a great number of the Conference attendees to be present along with the regular congregation.
********************************
I just want to note a few things that I learned from the Conference:
90% of Charismatics around the world are Word-of-Faith or Prosperity Gospel believers, that is, those who follow the charlatans who promise health and wealth while fleecing the flock and living outrageously extravagant lives at the flock's expense, many of whom are extremely poor.
There is a music group called Jesus Culture that is apparently very popular with young people across all the denominations, whose hypnotic repeated phrases can serve as an enticement to Charismatic doctrine. They come out of Bethel Church in Redding, California, one of the wildest Charismatic churches these days, where the kind of phenomena seen in the "Toronto Blessing" and the "Brownsville Revival" are experienced. Video of both these phenomena and performances of Jesus Culture were shown at the Conference.
Pastor Conrad Mbewe of Zambia presented a sad picture of the biggest churches in Africa these days, which are charismatic churches, where the pastors are no longer preaching the word of God but behaving more like witch doctors and committing sexual sins with members of their churches, one pastor having fathered ten children by as many women in his church, and nobody condemns these practices. We often hear that great revivals are ongoing in Africa, apparently based on these very large congregations, but Pastor Mbewe made it unfortunately all too clear that if this is revival it certainly isn't CHRISTIAN revival but something pagan to the core.
Over and over it was demonstrated at this Conference that absolutely nothing good has come out of the Charismatic Movement, that the supernatural powers claimed always turn out to be bogus and that there is a very high incidence of immorality among the leaders. This ought to be apparent to those of us who have had experience of the movement, as so very very little of it is ever really convincing, it's mostly all rhetoric.
I think it was Steve Lawson who presented the information about the Puritans along with many others of the greats of the church through history as having specifically denounced the sort of claims to supernatural powers that are claimed by today's Charismatics, and specifically declared that the supernatural gifts had ceased. This I want to hear again.
I was also interested to hear John MacArthur denounce the Jesus Freaks of the 60s and 70s for changing the style of the churches. This included the change to casual dress and new music styles, both bringing the hippy culture into our standard Christian experience and laying the foundation for many of the excesses the Conference was exposing. I'm so used to hearing that the Jesus Freaks were an authentic revival, that stuffy and hidebound churches had missed this move of God that saved thousands (which did happen), that I simply hadn't given any thought to the cultural impact they had on the Church, which was NOT for the better. The general trend to trivializing and demeaning God and worship can be traced back to them.
Well, all that is off the top of my head and I may add to it later. I was educated, exhilarated and uplifted by everything about this Conference, it was extremely well done in every way I can think of, from the program to the music to the best streaming arrangement I've ever seen.
However, after the Conference I found myself in a discussion with a very pro-Charismatic friend who hadn't seen the Conference and didn't seem to think he needed to see it, but threw all the usual Charismatic arguments at me, even accusing me of the usual spiritual failures Charismatics generally accuse nonCharismatics of. I suppose that's to be expected and I also expect that the internet is going to be hopping with arguments about the Conference for some time to come.
Thursday, October 17, 2013
Strange Fire Conference: Medicine for the Church
I've been watching a wonderful Conference exposing the errors in the Charismatic Movement put on by John MacArthur's church in Southern California. It started yesterday morning but I didn't hear about it until the evening. I did hear the talk by the African pastor Conrad Mbewe as well as today's talks so far by MacArthur, Tom Pennington, Phil Johnson and the panel which just finished and they've all been great talks, even eye-opening for me. I'll be coming back for the 7 PM PDT talk by Steve Lawson. Then the Conference continues tomorrow as well. It's being streamed live at http://www.tmstrangefire.org/
For years I've struggled with uncertainty about some of the charismatic phenomena, the claims to personal supernatural powers, especially the gift of prophecy but also healings and other miracles and so on, and although I pulled out of that movement in the early 90s after seeing through many of its errors, and have recognized even more errors as the years have gone by, there has always remained a bit of doubt in my mind. I read books attempting to show how the whole thing is false, even John MacArthur's book Charismatic Chaos, without being absolutely convinced.
For one thing there are many true Christians in the charismatic churches, and if they don't see through it that contributes to my doubt.
For another the arguments from the Bible have never been completely convincing, just too vague.
Well, today a pastor from Texas, Tom Pennington, finally mustered the Bible in a way that completely convinced me: The men in the Bible who were able to perform miracles were ALWAYS men God had chosen to be His particular spokesmen, and the miracles were given to demonstrate that the teaching did come from God. That was true of Moses for starters, of many others of God's people through the Old Testament, and it was especially true of the apostles who did miraculous works to show that Jesus Christ was truly from God. And many in the early church had supernatural gifts for the same reason, to validate the work of Christ.
They are careful to say that just because the supernatural gifts ceased because they are given for the specific purpose of ratifying a person or work as from God, that that doesn't mean God has stopped working in the world and in our personal lives, and may still do miracles if He so wills.
I hope the conference is going to continue to be available because I'd like to hear that talk again among others. All the other talks have been excellent, it's just that right now this one stands out in my mind.
And a couple of remarks by Justin Peters on the afternoon panel also stand out. His point was that true Christians can lend credence to false teachers by merely appearing with them, as on the Trinity Broadcasting Network, a point I've made about Jonathan Cahn's appearances on many charismatic shows, as well as on Glenn Beck. Cahn is a charismatic but he should have more discernment than that.
AND STOP GIVING CREDENCE TO ROMAN CATHOLICISM TOO:
Justin Peters also objected to Christians going on Fox News, say O'Reilly's show, giving credence to Roman Catholicism, even calling Catholics "brother," and that made me VERY happy. It's so rare that anyone will call out anything Catholic these days and that's one of the biggest hidden rotten spots in today's Church. Fox News as a whole should be shunned by Christians because the station as a whole is Roman Catholic. It's so seductive because there are so many Catholics who have a right and even Christian understanding of what's wrong with this country, but the true Church has to wake up and agree not to give any support to that evil Antichrist system, the system whose doctrines cannot save but send millions to Hell every day, the system that martyred millions of true Christians down the centuries and is still looking only to regain the power it lost through the Reformation.
That's enough of a note for now. I hope many who may not have known about it will listen to the rest of this conference, and I look forward to following the buzz that's sure to follow.
For years I've struggled with uncertainty about some of the charismatic phenomena, the claims to personal supernatural powers, especially the gift of prophecy but also healings and other miracles and so on, and although I pulled out of that movement in the early 90s after seeing through many of its errors, and have recognized even more errors as the years have gone by, there has always remained a bit of doubt in my mind. I read books attempting to show how the whole thing is false, even John MacArthur's book Charismatic Chaos, without being absolutely convinced.
For one thing there are many true Christians in the charismatic churches, and if they don't see through it that contributes to my doubt.
For another the arguments from the Bible have never been completely convincing, just too vague.
Well, today a pastor from Texas, Tom Pennington, finally mustered the Bible in a way that completely convinced me: The men in the Bible who were able to perform miracles were ALWAYS men God had chosen to be His particular spokesmen, and the miracles were given to demonstrate that the teaching did come from God. That was true of Moses for starters, of many others of God's people through the Old Testament, and it was especially true of the apostles who did miraculous works to show that Jesus Christ was truly from God. And many in the early church had supernatural gifts for the same reason, to validate the work of Christ.
They are careful to say that just because the supernatural gifts ceased because they are given for the specific purpose of ratifying a person or work as from God, that that doesn't mean God has stopped working in the world and in our personal lives, and may still do miracles if He so wills.
I hope the conference is going to continue to be available because I'd like to hear that talk again among others. All the other talks have been excellent, it's just that right now this one stands out in my mind.
And a couple of remarks by Justin Peters on the afternoon panel also stand out. His point was that true Christians can lend credence to false teachers by merely appearing with them, as on the Trinity Broadcasting Network, a point I've made about Jonathan Cahn's appearances on many charismatic shows, as well as on Glenn Beck. Cahn is a charismatic but he should have more discernment than that.
AND STOP GIVING CREDENCE TO ROMAN CATHOLICISM TOO:
Justin Peters also objected to Christians going on Fox News, say O'Reilly's show, giving credence to Roman Catholicism, even calling Catholics "brother," and that made me VERY happy. It's so rare that anyone will call out anything Catholic these days and that's one of the biggest hidden rotten spots in today's Church. Fox News as a whole should be shunned by Christians because the station as a whole is Roman Catholic. It's so seductive because there are so many Catholics who have a right and even Christian understanding of what's wrong with this country, but the true Church has to wake up and agree not to give any support to that evil Antichrist system, the system whose doctrines cannot save but send millions to Hell every day, the system that martyred millions of true Christians down the centuries and is still looking only to regain the power it lost through the Reformation.
That's enough of a note for now. I hope many who may not have known about it will listen to the rest of this conference, and I look forward to following the buzz that's sure to follow.
Wednesday, September 25, 2013
The Strange Attacks on Jonathan Cahn, author of The Harbinger, spelled out on Chris Rosebrough's radio show
Chris Rosebrough is a Christian discernment broadcaster with a Lutheran point of view who is interviewing Jonathan Cahn in this program
, very thoroughly covering all the ways Cahn has been slandered by his critics, falsely accused of supporting Replacement Theology, Gnosticism, Dominionism, British Israelism, Mormonism, Jewish Mysticism and various other errors, all patently false accusations if you know anything about Cahn's ministry. It's a good corrective that is much needed.
The only objection I have to this presentation is that I agree with Cahn's critics in that I think there is a real danger of appearing to condone a program host's theology in some cases so that it isn't right to claim that every program is just an opportunity to give the gospel, which is Cahn's argument, and that there is no danger involved. This problem gets glossed over on this program, as if it's ALL just a matter of Cahn's wanting to get the gospel out however it's possible to do so, but in some cases this reasoning doesn't hold water.
It depends on the program. If it's a purely secular program there's no problem that I can see, because nobody expects a Christian to be in agreement with the host, but if the program host purports to be a Christian or to represent a Christian point of view, as for instance Mormons do, or of course the New Apostolic Reformation representatives do, THEN there can be a problem and it's at least naïve to deny it. Of course there is no problem if the program host IS Christian although of a different denomination or tradition, which Chris Rosebrough is, since the gospel basics are shared by both; the problems come in only when the program backs a theologically false position but calls itself Christian.
Although Cahn may not personally know or support a particular teacher, simply appearing in a context where that teacher is endorsed can suggest that or at least raise questions about it that do need to be addressed. For instance, Jonathan Cahn says he does not know Rick Joyner who is a leader of the New Apostolic Reformation, which I've discussed here before, but by appearing on Sid Roth's show, It's Supernatural, and owning Roth as a friend, who is a strong supporter of Joyner and by extension the NAR, and in general a not-very-discerning supporter of all kinds of things supernatural, he does tacitly align himself with Joyner and the NAR movement, and that is very dangerous because the NAR is an apostate movement. All you have to do is go watch a couple of Sunday "services" at Rick Joyner's "church" on You Tube to see that he's gone way over the line into a very primitive paganism, and the signs and wonders produced in that context are far from Christian in any sense of the word.
It also makes little sense for starters to claim you are appearing on shows that clearly present themselves as Christian in order to get the gospel out since they believe they themselves represent the gospel. The only way you could credibly claim to be doing that is if you clearly and explicitly said ON THE PROGRAM ITSELF that you have a different point of view about the gospel itself and what it means to be Christian.
Same with Glenn Beck I'm afraid. Beck talks a strong religious line of his own that distorts the Biblical record to support his Mormon belief system. Of course it is stupid to accuse Cahn of supporting Mormonism just because Mormons like his book, but unfortunately there is a way that his appearance on Beck's show, with Beck sounding so supportive of his book, could lend a credibility to Mormonism in the minds of many in Beck's audience who know nothing about these things, despite Cahn's beliefs or intentions.
But again, that may suggest nothing more than a kind of naivete on Cahn's part and I have no OTHER objection to either his book or his teachings as far as I know them, or his appearances on various media.
Anyone who would like to know how Cahn has been slandered and misrepresented should listen to this broadcast which aims to cover all the bases.
The only objection I have to this presentation is that I agree with Cahn's critics in that I think there is a real danger of appearing to condone a program host's theology in some cases so that it isn't right to claim that every program is just an opportunity to give the gospel, which is Cahn's argument, and that there is no danger involved. This problem gets glossed over on this program, as if it's ALL just a matter of Cahn's wanting to get the gospel out however it's possible to do so, but in some cases this reasoning doesn't hold water.
It depends on the program. If it's a purely secular program there's no problem that I can see, because nobody expects a Christian to be in agreement with the host, but if the program host purports to be a Christian or to represent a Christian point of view, as for instance Mormons do, or of course the New Apostolic Reformation representatives do, THEN there can be a problem and it's at least naïve to deny it. Of course there is no problem if the program host IS Christian although of a different denomination or tradition, which Chris Rosebrough is, since the gospel basics are shared by both; the problems come in only when the program backs a theologically false position but calls itself Christian.
Although Cahn may not personally know or support a particular teacher, simply appearing in a context where that teacher is endorsed can suggest that or at least raise questions about it that do need to be addressed. For instance, Jonathan Cahn says he does not know Rick Joyner who is a leader of the New Apostolic Reformation, which I've discussed here before, but by appearing on Sid Roth's show, It's Supernatural, and owning Roth as a friend, who is a strong supporter of Joyner and by extension the NAR, and in general a not-very-discerning supporter of all kinds of things supernatural, he does tacitly align himself with Joyner and the NAR movement, and that is very dangerous because the NAR is an apostate movement. All you have to do is go watch a couple of Sunday "services" at Rick Joyner's "church" on You Tube to see that he's gone way over the line into a very primitive paganism, and the signs and wonders produced in that context are far from Christian in any sense of the word.
It also makes little sense for starters to claim you are appearing on shows that clearly present themselves as Christian in order to get the gospel out since they believe they themselves represent the gospel. The only way you could credibly claim to be doing that is if you clearly and explicitly said ON THE PROGRAM ITSELF that you have a different point of view about the gospel itself and what it means to be Christian.
Same with Glenn Beck I'm afraid. Beck talks a strong religious line of his own that distorts the Biblical record to support his Mormon belief system. Of course it is stupid to accuse Cahn of supporting Mormonism just because Mormons like his book, but unfortunately there is a way that his appearance on Beck's show, with Beck sounding so supportive of his book, could lend a credibility to Mormonism in the minds of many in Beck's audience who know nothing about these things, despite Cahn's beliefs or intentions.
But again, that may suggest nothing more than a kind of naivete on Cahn's part and I have no OTHER objection to either his book or his teachings as far as I know them, or his appearances on various media.
Anyone who would like to know how Cahn has been slandered and misrepresented should listen to this broadcast which aims to cover all the bases.
Saturday, September 7, 2013
Replacement Theology again
I just posted a comment I received while I was away for the last month, on a blog entry about Replacement Theology, the idea that Israel was God's chosen people but lost that status so that now the Church inherits the promises to Israel.
The comment writer advised listening to John MacArthur on the subject so I found a ten minute talk of his at You Tube.
I don't claim to be up on all the issues involved in this controversy and I may have some of it wrong, so comments on this post are welcome.
But here's my take on MacArthur's talk:
It may be that there is such a thing as Replacement Theology which describes Israel as having forfeited God's promises so that now the Church has replaced Israel in inheriting those promises. I don't know for sure. MacArthur calls those who believe in Replacement Theology Amillennialists.
Since I don't believe there are two different saved entities, the Church and the nation of Israel, but only one body of believers, the Church, I can be accused of a version of Replacement Theology. But I'm not an amillennialist (I discussed this belief sometime ago on my End Times Monitor blog), and I don't think in terms of the Church "replacing" Israel AT ALL. There is no such thing as "replacement theology" in reality in my view. I haven't actually run across the idea as MacArthur describes it but as I said perhaps it is held by some. In any case I don't share it.
I don't know what position I represent exactly but I am very sure it is not unique to me. The idea is basically that the Old Testament is full of "types and shadows" of God's redemptive plan, types of Christ certainly in many OT figures, as well as in the tabernacle design, but also "Israel" was a type. Types are symbols or templates or prophetic figures, they are not the Reality. The Reality of the types of Christ is Christ Himself. The earthly nation and people of Israel in the Old Testament were a type of the Church, the Jewish believers from Abraham on are all the Church, the Church in an incomplete form, which Christ completed. The Church in the Old Testament also includes all the pre-Abrahamic believers, the Patriarchs from Seth to Noah for instance, and Job as well..
Certainly Israel was and is a real place on the planet, but it is nevertheless a type of something greater, something heavenly, that is the TRUE land promised to God's people. Israel itself merely represents or typifies that promised land, it is not in itself that promised land, except in the most limited, temporary interim sense.
So it's not that the promises no longer apply to the Jews, it's that they ALWAYS applied to God's people whoever and whenever and wherever they are found -- "God's people" meaning BELIEVERS. Not all Israel believed. Israel in one type IS the Church, the Israel of the believing Jews. There is no replacement, the promises belonged then and always to believing Israel AS the Church.
We are to understand the Old Testament through the New Testament. One very important clue to how we are to understand the land given to Abraham for instance is to be found in the Letter to the Hebrews, which is quite clear that Abraham did not regard the earthly land of Canaan, now Israel, as the land God was promising to him:
Hebrews 11:9-10 By faith he sojourned in the land of promise, as in a strange country, dwelling in tabernacles with Isaac and Jacob, the heirs with him of the same promise: For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God.
If Abraham didn't view it that way why are so many these days insisting on this view of it? On this planet we dwell in "tabernacles," or tents, as in an impermanent home, and with our father Abraham we look to another city altogether, built by God, as our permanent dwelling place. The "land" of promise is not an earthly land at all. "The meek shall inherit the earth," not a small portion of earth but the entire earth, a renovated earth.
NOW, if someone wants to argue that NEVERTHELESS God has plans for earthly Israel as the End Times are fast engulfing us, pointing to undeniable scriptural fact that great numbers of Jews will be ushered into the Kingdom of God, the Church, in these last days, and showing from scripture whatever references DO apply to an earthly fulfillment of the promises of God, I'm not going to object. I think the fact that Israel has been reconstituted in our time and is now a state and now a focus of political and religious hatreds from enemies around the world is in itself a very clear indication that God has His hand on her, so I would expect that some of the OT scriptures DO apply to earthly Israel although I haven't done a study to determine which.
This view is all about God's plans to bring the six-thousand-year history He's overseen on this earthly planet to a fitting close that demonstrates that He is indeed God and Lord of Lords. I also believe that Jesus will literally return to this Earth at the Mount of Olives. There are scripture references that indicate plenty of events along these lines. I regard the Millennium as yet future and expect it to be played out on this earthly planet as well. All that seems quite possible to me from what scripture seems to say.
I'm also not going to suggest that the Jews won't have a specially favored position in the Millennium or the heavenly land of promise. They were God's firstborn in a sense and I expect them to have places of honor.
Even so, all that plays out on this planet remains incomplete, remains type and shadow in a sense. God will judge us for our lives here, but our promise is a heavenly promise, the New Jerusalem, not the old, and that is the promise to Jew and Gentile alike. Ultimately a new heavens and a new earth, the old having passed away completely forever.
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