Oy!

Update July 9, last part of interview discussed below.

This is really distressing. I do not understand how so many reputable Christians can be so wrong while feeling so right about what they are saying about The Harbinger.

How can there be a problem with hermeneutics about one simple verse in Isaiah (9:10) that simply demonstrates that God brought judgment against Israel, in the form of an invasion that destroyed buildings and trees, and that Israel's attitude was defiance?

There is nothing complicated about the verse, and nothing is changed in its interpretation by including the entire context before and after it either.

Yet they continue to treat it as if Jonathan Cahn himself had made up the "harbingers," the events that so uncannily repeat the elements of that verse, and get carried away about his supposedly wrong hermeneutic in applying the verse to modern America. How can they get this SO wrong? Cahn didn't apply anything to America, he DISCOVERED the harbingers existing in REALITY. The harbingers are simply THERE, out there in REALITY.

What is the matter with these people?

As for "mysticism" there is ONE dream toward the end of the book that was the fictional device for introducing the consecration of America to God by George Washington. Jimmy DeYoung actually says this accounts for a "major portion" of the book. Again, this dream occurs at the very end of the book after all the harbingers have been demonstrated to exist and the dream is simply a way to introduce the idea that God does have a special relationship with America. Of course they also refuse to accept the idea of such a relationship no matter what various founders had in mind, both the early Puritan settlers and the federal government of Washington. The problem here is their dispensationalism that denies that God would take such a role toward any nation other than Israel.

Then there is the discovery that Jonathan Cahn quoted the mystical writing The Zohar in a talk he gave, expressing enthusiasm for the fact that the Zohar in its reference to "Golgotha" appears to recognize something yet to come about the crucifixion of the Messiah. Cahn tries to explain this in terms of the testimony of a hostile witness carrying a great deal of weight in a court of law and they can't hear it. To them if he quoted the Zohar that only means he's promoting the Zohar.

Please, this is stupid. These men aren't stupid but this is stupid and most of what they are saying about Jonathan Cahn and The Harbinger is stupid. They even resort to appealing to their training and their credentials as if that can make stupid statements intelligent.

Well, all I'm doing is repeating myself. Same conclusion I came to below.

==============================
This is exhausting. This is insane. Today (July 5) Brannon Howse is replaying some of the interview with Jonathan Cahn from his program on the 3rd, with Jimmy DeYoung there to give his answer to it.

I'll just jump to my conclusion because it would be exhausting and probably futile anyway by now to try to wend my way there through the thicket of bizarre misunderstandings:

Jonathan got put through a theological shredder, drawn into the completely irrelevant theological proccupations of Howse and DeYoung, and I hope at least he now knows he has to avoid this sort of thing in future: stick to the message of The Harbinger, stay off the rabbit trails, which ALL these theological preoccupations are in the context of The Harbinger. There was no way to know this in advance, but it's painfully clear now that no good can come of trying to answer them.

As I keep saying, what the critics MUST account for is the reality of the events called "harbingers" as they appeared in REALITY, in AMERICA, in the wake of 9/11, events which UNCANNILY precisely repeat the elements of Isaiah 9:10. Their reality, the uncanniness of them, needs to be drummed into the heads of these people who keep getting mired in extraneous concerns. They ARE extraneous to the meaning of the book. The book stands completely apart from such theological considerations.

Isaiah 9:10 makes a very simple statement about destruction brought by God to ancient Israel, and Israel's refusal to take this as judgment from God, declaring that they will rebuild the destroyed buildings and replant the destroyed trees. It's SIMPLE.

And then those same events described in Isaiah 9:10 that happened in Israel also happened in America, including the same attitude of defiance toward God, all these same elements showing up in America IN REALITY in connection with 9/11. IT'S SIMPLE.

Amazing, mind-blowing, but SIMPLE.

In this sort of situation all you can do is KEEP IT SIMPLE, even painfully repetitive if necessary.

There is NO need for any discussion of hermeneutics, there is no need to get into differing opinions of eschatological events, there is no need to argue about the gifts for today -- NONE of that matters in the context of the message of The Harbinger. The Harbinger is ALL in the REAL appearance of the events called the "harbingers" that so precisely repeat the events of Isaiah 9:10.

They need to acknowledge this reality and then it's THEIR problem how to fit that reality into their theology and their eschatology. It's not Cahn's responsibility to answer all their questions. But of course, again, this wasn't apparent at first, it only seems right to try to account for your beliefs since they are making so much of them, but it turns out there is nothing constructive in the effort.

THEY NEED TO BE MADE TO ANSWER THE MAIN POINT.

IF you can get across the simple truth of the amazing uncanniness of the harbingers based on Isaiah 9:10 THEN you can try to go on to their further implications such as their appearance at the site of Washington's consecration of America to God, the Buttonwood Agreement and the other Old-Testament-based signs connected with the Shemitah, but with people who are determined to throw out the whole lot based on their own irrelevant preconceptions, the point is to get the simple stuff acknowledged FIRST. Spend a whole hour on the sycamore alone if necessary. If they try to deny that the harbingers ARE precise echoes of Isaiah 9:10 I don't know if there is a cure for that degree of denseness but simple hammering at the facts seems about all that can be done in any case. Again, all those questions are only a distraction from the message of The Harbinger and confuse listeners.

This is just a species of Categorical Thinking, of Howse and DeYoung having such an iron grip on a particular way of construing theology they can't even hear an opposing viewpoint. The mind has hardened to concrete around its categories and there is no point in trying to break through it. You're just beating your head against all the preconceptions. They have the ability to grind to bits any opposing point of view as it comes at them.

Just stick to the simplest simplest simplest possible statement of facts.

They need to acknowledge the reality of the harbingers and then it's THEIR problem how to fit that reality into their theology and their eschatology.

THEY NEED TO BE MADE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THIS CENTRAL POINT.


Aside from that general assessment, a few words about a couple of the main points that were discussed:

Howse and DeYoung make much of the fact that there is a dream in the story, both of them apparently very confused about the fact that Jonathan says the dream is not real in the context of the statement at the front of the book that the facts are real.

The dream as part of the fictional narrative is the FICTIONAL source of some of the FACTUAL information in the book. Cahn is VERY clear that it's fiction, part of the story but that the FACTS, what is TRUE in the story, which they seem to be so crazily confused about, did not IN REALITY come from a dream. None of the FACTS came IN REALITY from a dream. The dream is a FICTIONAL DEVICE, period.

But because Howse asks what Jonathan thinks about receiving truth from God in dreams he feels obliged to try to answer honestly that he thinks God can speak in that way as well as many other ways these days because he does not believe the theology that says all such ways of God's speaking to His people stopped with the closing of the canon.

So Jimmy DeYoung takes the opportunity to spell out his own theology about how it DID all stop, leaving no room for respectable dissent from his theology -- no, it IS as he says it is and Cahn is a heretic for believing otherwise. Cahn is trying graciously to allow disagreement on these things, but Howse and DeYoung aren't willing to allow disagreement on these points, or even allow a lack of having studied the issue sufficiently to have a clear opinion.

This theology has nothing whatever to do with the message of The Harbinger, which went begging in the interview by Howse and is going begging again today.

Same with the character of The Prophet. The Prophet is part of the STORY, he is not REAL, but what he is leading the protagonist Nouriel to discover IS REAL. DeYoung even insists that if the Prophet's message is real, the Prophet himself must be real too -- or was it, if the Prophet is fiction the message must be fiction too --either case is so absurd I'm speechless. For half a second anyway.

Is all this clear to me only because I heard Jonathan speak on these things without the fictional structure of the book to interfere?

I don't think so because thousands have read the book and not been confused by these things.

What's left here?

Well, there's more that could be addressed, if there's any point.

Otherwise, prayer I guess, a lot of prayer, for wisdom of course, and that God will bring about what He wills from this theological train wreck.

Spiritual Deception and The Harbinger --Shouldn't we be trying to learn/show the way out of deception instead of just pointing the finger?

I don't know what Jonathan Cahn thinks of the phenomena associated with people like Rick Joyner and Todd Bentley, signs-and-wonders gurus you could call them, who represent the charismatic NAR (New Apostolic Reformation) that Brannon Howse spends much time exposing (and rightly so). This movement promotes the idea that apostles and prophets on the model of the New Testament church are now in operation again. Because of the Prophet character in The Harbinger this is one of the tangents criticism of the book takes (just one of them, there's also the supposed hermeneutic problem which is really the critics' problem and not Cahn's, and the supposed "mysticism" problem that is somewhat different from the NAR problem). Cahn says he hasn't investigated these things enough to have an opinion and I have no reason to doubt him. He also says he wasn't aware of this whole "discernment" arena of controversy before his book came out, and I believe him about that too. It's hit him like a rock from outer space. Or something like that. Unanticipated anyway.

Sid Roth, who was shown by Howse recently to endorse Todd Bentley's demonic carryings-on, is a friend of Cahn's and a strong Messianic supporter, and the criticism of Roth may put Cahn in the uncomfortable position of now possibly having to think about some of Roth's opinions that he'd not thought about before. Which have nothing to do with The Harbinger and come as an unwelcome intrusion on his efforts to get that message to the public.

They DON'T have anything to do with the message of The Harbinger, they ARE an intrusion, but they do highlight a theological division among Christians, and specifically between Jonathan Cahn and his critics, that could use some investigation from outside both camps.

I did a few blog posts fairly recently with the aim of trying to sort out some of the confusions of the signs-and-wonders phenomena we're seeing so much of these days -- I got three posts done on the subject and then was drawn again to address the criticisms of The Harbinger, but this post may get me back to it.

Because I was in a charismatic church as well as a parachurch group in the early 90s I have some feeling for how hard it can be to discern the source of the phenomena experienced in those groups, even despite much inner alarm about it. I agree completely with Brannon Howse about the NAR -- NOW, but when you are among people who accept such phenomena unquestioningly it is not so easy to sort the true from the false. It's easy enough for those on the outside, however, who take the blanket position that NO "supernatural" phenomena are biblically supportable today, to simply denounce the whole thing -- little discernment is involved in that case. But there are some who are convinced that God MAY work supernaturally today, believe they've seen it in operation, and are more concerned not to throw out the baby with the bathwater.

Some of the writings of Watchman Nee and Jessie Penn-Lewis are to my mind a source of standards that may help to discriminate among these things. Both are strongly convinced that they've witnessed God's supernatural workings among Christians (supernatural gifts such as tongues, prophecies, visions, even sometimes miraculous events, and so on), and yet both have written strong warnings against spiritual deception by "signs and wonders."

While I find their writings persuasive I also feel I have to say that it's possible that they are too credulous themselves about the phenomena they attribute to God, but I'm not anywhere near a position to make a judgment about this, it's just a provisional caveat.

I believe their concept of "soul power" helps to identify some "supernatural" phenomena as clearly NOT of the Holy Spirit, such as Rick Joyner's strange "worship services" shown in videos linked in earlier posts, in which emotion is being worked up by drums and physical exertions like jumping up and down, much the way the shamans of many tribal religions work it up. Joyner's congregation just need to decorate themselves with paint and beads and feathers and get their moves more coordinated and the similarity would become apparent.

As I discussed in the earlier posts on this subject, intensified emotion can be a releaser of "soul power," aided and abetted by demonic powers, which is the aim of the tribal religions and all they have to work with, but in Christians it interferes with and easily supplants the working of the Holy Spirit. Repetitive singing of simple choruses, or chanting or "prayer" -- such as the endlessly repeated "Jesus prayer" of the Russian "holy man" or Starets -- is also a releaser of "soul power."

Soul power can be the source of visions, "prophecies," supernatural knowledge, some of it even true, "tongues," clairvoyance, "remote viewing," psychokinetic effects and other phenomena known well to the practitioners of religions such as Hinduism and Buddhism as well as tribal religions. There may also be and usually is demonic influence involved as well.

The critics of The Harbinger are trying to attribute this sort of thing to Jonathan Cahn, and since he has apparently not spent time investigating these things he hasn't been in a position to answer them. Really, the answer is that they have nothing to do with The Harbinger that anyone has demonstrated; the message of the book speaks for itself IF the reader will take the time to think it through. I don't see ANY way the "harbingers" could have been counterfeited by soul power or demonic spirits or ordinary deceptive reasoning, but this is what the critics would have to show if their harping on these themes has any foundation at all.

Meanwhile, IF Jonathan Cahn has been accepting of some charismatic phenomena he shouldn't be accepting, he might find Nee and Penn-Lewis' standards illuminating. So might Rick Joyner for that matter, who seems to simply assume anything supernatural is from God as so many charismatics do. Or Sid Roth who apparently is too easily taken in by supernatural claims and has apparently been dazzled by Todd Bentley's demonic carryings-on.

That is, SOME of these things may simply be naively attributed to God among the signs-and-wonders people. In other words, perhaps SOME who are caught up in charismatic phenomena could be helped to discern what is of God from what isn't by this sort of knowledge.

I'll have to look it up but as I recall, one prominent leader in the Welsh revival (1904-5), Evan Roberts, who was a friend of Jessie Penn-Lewis, discovered that he was being deceived by demon spirits, which brought about a crisis of discernment and spiritual confusion in his life. It's a sad story, but the point is that well-meaning true Christians who preach the true gospel CAN be deceived by these things, and in fact it is often those who are MOST zealous for the things of God who are most susceptible to this sort of deception -- because their emotions are easily engaged and they are likely to be particularly intense in their pursuit of knowledge of God -- such intensity being a possible trigger of counterfeits. It isn't helpful just to throw accusations at them from a position of complete ignorance of such phenomena. The aim should be to learn and inform and try to help them discern if at all possible. Those who reject all supernatural phenomena really aren't in a position to do this but at least they could learn that maybe their total rejection needs to be modified.

But back to basics: As both Nee and Penn-Lewis emphasize -- and for that matter most of the "mystics" of the past too, including some who have gone off the deep end -- even supernatural phenomena that DO come from God are best not clung to, best not made much of. The Christian method is DYING TO SELF, not trying to work up ANYTHING. Working-things-up, trying to make things happen, seeking experiences, whether by special actions, movements, chantings, "prayers," whatever, is probably the first thing Christians should learn to avoid. Instead there is obviously a trend in the opposite direction these days. God MAY come to us with special spiritual experiences or He may not. Forcing it will certainly only bring about counterfeits, either through human soulish powers or demonic spirits. Any tinge of trying to force God ought to be repented of in fear and trembling and fled like the plague it is.

However, AGAIN, The Harbinger, as far as I can see, HAS NOTHING TO DO WITH ANY OF THIS.

Another interview of Jonathan Cahn by Brannon Howse: another exercise in futility

Brannon Howse had Jonathan Cahn on again, and kept saying how courageous it was of Cahn to come on the show, but why would it take courage? (I'm suspicious of a power play here, to keep the upper hand, but maybe I'm being unfair).

Rather than its taking courage, on the contrary Cahn must have been eager for the opportunity to try to correct the many misunderstandings of The Harbinger in the previous programs Howse has done on the book.

Not that there was really much of an opportunity, however, as Howse simply has a head full of questions he wants answered that have nothing to do with The Harbinger, the usual irrelevant criticisms that focus on the packaging or structure of the book rather than the message.

It's unfortunately only too clear that Brannon Howse has absolutely no idea what The Harbinger is about, and most likely doesn't really understand the answers Cahn gave to the questions he asked either. Still hasn't read the book of course.

Again, as I keep saying, what the critics have to account for is the reality of the "harbingers," those events that so uncannily echo Isaiah 9:10 that just happened to occur in connection with the attack on the WTC on 9/11, that is, they have to account for them as having any other source than God Himself. It's the appearance of the harbingers that amazes those readers who *get it,* that's what has made the book a best seller. So far the critics have missed it completely.

Comment posted on The Harbinger

Want to be sure when I get a comment on The Harbinger that it comes to the reader's attention. This one was posted on my Monday June 25 blog about the bad hermeneutics of the critics of the book. The writer claims that The Harbinger violates sound hermeneutics but as with all the critics so far fails to make the point.

July 1: There's a follow-up comment at the same link. The strangeness of the attacks on the Harbinger has to make you wonder what the devil has against it.

Another very weary attempt to get it said about The Harbinger

Here's more of the Worldview Weekend radio show I blogged on in my last post.

This makes me SO tired. I'll just have to say it again:

YOU HAVE TO EXPLAIN THE APPEARANCE OF THE HARBINGERS AS COMING FROM ANY SOURCE OTHER THAN GOD. THAT IS THE BOTTOM LINE AS I'VE SAID OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN.

All Jonathan Cahn's questionable associations are relevant only if the harbingers are not from God or if you can prove that he used mystical or gnostic methods or a wrong hermeneutic in his presentation. He DIDN'T, all that is being wrongly attributed to him.

Brannon Howse says a lot of true things about today's Christian drive to save the nation at the expense of the gospel. He's trying to lump the Harbinger in with this drive and to the extent that some may take it as an important message of judgment that might save the nation and use it as a reason to unite with unbelievers he has a point, but not a point that applies to Jonathan Cahn himself or the motives behind The Harbinger itself. Howse can quote many who actively support the apostate views of the people they are associating with. AS FAR AS I'M AWARE, HE CAN'T DO THAT WITH JONATHAN CAHN WHO REMAINS COMMITTED TO THE TRUE GOSPEL AND THE NEED FOR MORMONS, MUSLIMS, JEWS, NEW AGERS, HINDUS AND SO ON TO COME TO CHRIST FOR SALVATION.

Even if Cahn appears on questionable venues he has never SAID anything that agrees with apostate views.

For myself nothing I've said about The Harbinger is about feeling I have to accept an ecumenical compromise position to ward off the coming disaster, God's judgment on the nation, which Howse has suggested is the motive of those who defend The Harbinger, and I've also given up on any kind of spiritual awakening (except for myself I hope and small pockets of true believers, that could spread in at least a limited way) BECAUSE all the apostates and heretics and antichrists have taken over that hope. AND when it comes to discernment which he wishfully accords to DeYoung, D. James, T. A. McMahon and Christine Pack, I'm afraid this time he's picked the team that lacks it.

I did and do think that if God brought these harbingers about then we have the question what He wants to accomplish with this book. SHOW ME THAT THE HARBINGERS COULD HAVE COME ABOUT FROM ANY OTHER SOURCE THAN GOD HIMSELF. THERE IS NO OTHER REASON FOR THE HARBINGER.

We know without The Harbinger that the nation is coming under judgment, but nevertheless for some reason these harbingers of judgment HAVE APPEARED IN REALITY and NOBODY could have brought this about other than God Himself.

ALL THE CRITICS are addressing everything BUT this one important fact.

They are making up meanings of their own that are not in the book. Jimmy DeYoung criticizes the book from a position I consider to be at least a borderline heresy itself but Brannon Howse takes HIS word for all of it and hasn't read the book. Christine Pack carried on about the definition of gnosticism that has nothing whatever to do with The Harbinger just because of some words like mystery and secret that are also part of gnosticism, but in a context where they have nothing to do with gnosticism or mysticism. As I wrote about in the previous post.

They are PROJECTING the ideas of the apostates onto the book. SO FAR I HAVE NOT SEEN ANY JUSTIFICATION FOR THIS. IT'S THEIR OWN PRECONCEPTIONS THAT THEY ARE IMPOSING ON THE BOOK.

Cahn may lose me, however, on his willingness to appear on Glenn Beck's show and any other nonChristian shows in such a way that makes it appear he endorses false religions.* I'm sure his idea is just that he wants to get this message out to as many as he possibly can, as the watchman would who feels an obligation to warn everyone, and I'll have to take that into account. Since he's never said anything accepting of apostate positions, which the people Howse and others keep trying to stick on him, I may decide this puts him in a different category whether his message gets misused or not. This is going to take prayer and thought. A precedent might be the prophet Jonah's call to warn Nineveh of coming judgment. Who lived in Nineveh but idolators who didn't believe in the true God? And yet they repented when the judgment warning was preached to them.

But of course in our day the Mormons are not likely to hear anything that opposes their Mormonism unless the gospel is preached, and it won't be preached by Jonathan Cahn to the Mormons or he will not be a guest on Beck again. But if he doesn't then they are free to take the Harbinger as from THEIR God. Same with the Muslims, Hindus, whoever. Unless the gospel presentation in the book is used by God to save them, and of course that could happen. But again, this is going to take prayer and thought. I can't link Cahn with the ecumenicists, his motives are entirely different. I could be shown to be wrong, I suppose, but it hasn't happened yet.

All those apostates are probably not going to repent of what the nation NEEDS to repent of, which is the rampant apostasy itself. THIS is why Cahn's appearance on Glenn Beck is a problem, but again HIS motives are different from the ecumenicists so I'm waiting to see.

I NEVERTHELESS STILL CHALLENGE THE CRITICS TO SHOW A SOURCE OF THE HARBINGERS THAT IS NOT GOD. And don't give me that fuzzy stuff about how they don't REALLY fit Isaiah 9:10. Be honest -- they do.

One more remark: Brannon Howse played a clip of Cahn referring to the Zohar, the Jewish mystical book. As I heard it, what Cahn is doing is not teaching that anyone should follow the Zohar but only that it's remarkable that even this Jewish mystical sect RECOGNIZED THE TERM "GOLGOTHA" AS CONNECTED WITH THE MESSIAH, with the redemption of the world. I found something similar some years ago in a book about pre-Christian Jewish beliefs in the Messiah, that showed that the Jews anticipated two Messiahs (because of scripture's portraits of both the Suffering Servant and the Conquering King which they were unable to reconcile in one Messiah), even three in some writings, which without their being aware of it showed an anticipation of what turned out to be two advents of the Messiah first as suffering servant, then finally as King of Kings and Lord of Lords.

Showing that the Jews had some beliefs that can be reconciled with the New Testament reality of the Messiah is not the same thing as telling Christians to believe what the Jews believed in the Zohar or anywhere else. It shows only that before Jesus came, Jewish commentary was a lot more in line with the reality of the Messiah to come than they were willing to admit after He HAD come. When Jesus came and they rejected Him, it appears that they forgot all their former prophetic wisdom that DID far more closely anticipate the true appearance of the Lord.

===================================
* July 10: I changed my mind about this, soon after I wrote this post as a matter of fact. I think it's going way overboard to worry about how people are going to misconstrue an appearance by a Christian on a nonChristian program as supporting the nonChristian point of view. I'll say more about this eventually.

More irresponsible criticism of The Harbinger by Brannon Howse and Christine Pack

I would really love to get off The Harbinger and back to my new project on Catholicism but the stupidities continue to multiply.

Brannon Howse is coming up with new ways every day to find fault with The Harbinger that apparently didn't bother him before. I've got to suspect that the only reason he is carrying on this way is due to his friendship with Jimmy DeYoung who started the crazy attacks on The Harbinger. Yes, they are crazy.

So much for integrity, Brannon.

OF COURSE HE STILL HASN'T READ IT, on the false excuse that it's "fiction."

THIS IS IRRESPONSIBLE.

Today he's calling it "mysticism" and "gnosticism." WHY? It's like he just discovered the words on the COVER OF THE BOOK, about an "ancient mystery." It's the same thing he did yesterday with Jan Markell's calling it a "code" and likening Cahn to the prophets John and Jeremiah. That is, Brannon doesn't care whether they mean by those terms what he wants them to mean by them or not, it's enough for him that they can be used as flag words against The Harbinger. Wasn't the false accusation that the book replaces Israel with America enough? Gotta keep diggin up stuff to throw at it?

THIS IS IRRESPONSIBLE.

Actually, it turns out he got his new stones to throw from a new source, which he has published at his site, A Warning About the Harbinger by Christine Pack:

Posted: 06/27/12
A Commentary on The Harbinger: A Warning About The Harbinger
by Christine Pack

A book called The Harbinger is fast becoming a lightning rod issue among evangelical Christians, with many Christians saying it is exactly what America needs right now to "wake up" and repent, and come back to biblical truth, but other Christians documenting that Cahn quotes liberally from extra-biblical and mystical sources for his book.

Who? DOCUMENTING??? "LIBERALLY" yet??? WHAT extrabiblical and mystical sources???? If you are going to accuse him of that, you have to give the quotes you are referring to and the supposed extrabiblical or mystical source of them. *

THIS IS IRRESPONSIBLE.

The cover of Cahn's book (right) boldly claims that The Harbinger is an "Ancient Mystery that Holds the Secret of America's Future."

Yeah, right, this is how Brannon Howse just discovered what's been on the cover of the book all along. NOW somebody is making an issue of it.

I've mentioned myself that I wish the book weren't attended by so much hype. But that IS all it is, hype -- and the way you KNOW it is hype is by READING THE BOOK or listening to one of Cahn's talks on it. The facts are real, they really don't need all the hype and yes I wish Cahn wasn't so enamored of the hype words because I think they detract from the message. I suppose he sees it as a mystery being unveiled, and that's not wrong since certain connections between certain realities did have to be discovered -- as long as you don't make too much of the concept.

Now all of a sudden people have decided to make too much of it.

It wasn't enough to accuse Cahn of "replacement theology" and misapplying the Old Testament to our times (which is false theology right there), oh how gleeful they must have been to discover that Sid Roth who endorses the book also endorsed Todd Bentley's false revival, or that Cahn had decided to appear on Glenn Beck's show. Hey, that is all stuff to make one question the book, and I admit it gives me pause too. I still don't know how to put all these things together but I know the way Howse and company are putting them together is false.

I GO BACK TO THE FACTS AS PRESENTED IN THE BOOK AND THEY SPEAK FOR THEMSELVES. But this writer doesn't care about the facts either. She's into flag words too, it doesn't matter what they MEAN if they sort of remind you of or SOUND LIKE "gnosticism" or whatnot.

Could this be true? Could it be that there are hidden truths that need to be decoded and unveiled to Christians today? And if so, for what purpose? Cahn seems to think so, and has written a book which proclaims just that. The Harbinger is a fiction book, and features a character known as The Prophet who is slowly giving seals to one of the main characters. These seals contain messages (nine in all) which are meant to be put together as clues in a mystery, so that a final, distinct message will emerge and be revealed. This message, once decoded, is intimated to hold the secret to bringing America back to its moral center and becoming once again a Godly nation.

I have many concerns about this book, and so I will address them one at a time.

Gnosticism

There is an exchange between two of the characters in The Harbinger who are discussing a secret message from a mysterious character ("The Prophet") in the book:

"It's the appointed time, but not for an ancient nation. It's time for the word to be given.....for the mystery to be revealed.....for the message to go forth. It's the appointed time⎯but not for an ancient nation." (The Harbinger, p 13)
Friends, anytime you see language like this, and like the language below (also from The Harbinger).....

¡ "ancient mystery hidden for thousands of years......but now revealed"
¡ a "mystery" that holds a "secret" to our future
¡ "clues" needed to "unlock" a mystery
¡ "messages" that need to be "unveiled"
......what you are dealing with is an ancient heresy called Gnosticism.

Gnosticism is a very old heresy that teaches that the truth has to be decoded, uncovered, unlocked, unveiled, discovered.

Oh for crying out loud. Flag words. Word magic.

This is all to be put down to Jonathan Cahn's no doubt unfortunate love of drama and words like "mystery." But in simple FACT the mystery in this book is out there for anyone to discover, it's not a mystery in the gnostic sense at all. The book puts you through the paces of a fictional plot to discover each of the harbingers, for the sake of DRAMA, but the clues are not to anything hidden, it's all in plain sight for anyone to discover. To discover them you have to be aware of Isaiah 9:10. This verse from the Book of Isaiah IS the "ancient mystery," folks, it's not a gnostic mystery, it's just a Bible verse, but because what it describes has literally shown up in America it's become a message for America as well as Israel. Originally the connections between the harbingers and Isaiah 9:10 did have to be brought to Cahn's attention, by what means other than God I can't imagine, and he has come up with a fictional device to bring these connections to the attention of the reader. But once we are introduced to Isaiah 9:10 -- hey, it's in every Bible, you can go read it for yourself, there's nothing hidden about it -- once you become familiar with the verse in Isaiah, then you see the actual harbingers themselves are actually there in the world, the actual realities that reflect the elements referred to in that verse.

If this is Gnosticism Ms. Pack is a Six Pack, or a Pack of Lies or a packrat or a suitcase. Well, hey, the WORDS are there, she MUST be that.

Secret Knowledge = Gnosticism

Turning this kind of language into gnosticism is STUPID! It's some kind of logical fallacy or cognitive disorder, not sure which.

I used to read Nancy Drew mysteries when I was about ten. They use similar language. The Secret of the Old Clock, the Mystery of the Blah Blah. In fact, let's emphasize this: the sense in which The Harbinger is a mystery is much more along the lines of a mystery to be solved than a spiritual mystery, the Prophet is more like a sleuth than a prophet -- except he already knows all the answers -- and so on. Gnosticism has nothing to do with it.

Gnosticism is a heresy because, according to God, we are given all that we need for life and godliness (2 Peter 1:3) in God's word. We don't need to decode secret mysteries, unravel sealed up messages, decipher clues, or pull back the veil on hidden things. All that we need, all that God wants us to know, is contained in the Bible.

Yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah. If this had anything to do with The Harbinger I'd agree, but it has NOTHING to do with it. But the fact is that THE HARBINGERS ARE REAL, Cahn did not invent them. God did. You have to account for THAT.

Now, I will grant that in the New Testament, Paul does talk about the mystery of Gentiles and Jews being united together in a common church and common faith (something that could have scarcely been imagined in Old Testament times). There is also the mystery of Jesus Christ, who was dimly glimpsed through types and shadows in the Old Testament, but Who was gloriously revealed in his fullness as our Savior in the New Testament. But these are mysteries which are laid open for all to see and know and understand and respond to, and not clues on a Mysterious Journey to Somewhere (which is really the more western understanding of the word "mystery").

Well, golly gee, she knows there are other meanings to the word "mystery." Now if only she also had the good sense to know that The Harbinger does not use the word in the sense of gnosticism.

I'm courting an ulcer dealing with this sort of stupidity, and I'm not even happy myself with some decisions Jonathan Cahn has made for getting his message out, but the false accusations against it are still coming at it and still need to be answered.

I'll say it again: I'm still waiting for someone to explain those harbingers in any other way. UNTIL THEN EVERYTHING ELSE IN CRITICISM OF THE BOOK IS IRRELEVANT.

Somewhere in the rest of the article she says something like how we don't NEED the Harbinger to know the nation is under judgment, and I would agree but YOU STILL HAVE TO EXPLAIN THE APPEARANCE OF THOSE HARBINGERS THAT SO UNCANNILY REFLECT 9/11. THEY suggest that God wanted to impress the fact on us beyond what a few of us already know. Yes, God. Cahn didn't put the harbingers there. Howse, Pack, DeYoung, all the rest of them, are trying to make a case against the book without grappling with this central FACT that is the ONLY thing that needs to be thought about. THE ONLY THING.

===============================
*And I see below that she says Cahn referred to finding something in a mystical Jewish work, the Zohar, that reflects something he had been discovering, and implies he's explaining EVERYTHING in the book by this reference. Is he Ms. Pack?

"An incredible thing, it blew me away, I found it in the mystical writings, Jewish writings, of the Zohar*...." Jonathan Cahn, discussing extra-biblical, mystical writings as his sources.

Why don't you make it clear exactly WHAT he found reflected in the Zohar? In fact why don't you give us the reference where he said that so we can track it down?
===============================

She just goes on and on with the same irrelevancies. I'm not up to answering them at the moment, may come back later.

"I have not spoken in secret, from somewhere in a land of darkness; I have not said to Jacob's descendants, 'Seek me in vain.' I, the LORD, speak the truth; I declare what is right."(Isaiah 45:19) As a former Gnostic, I found great comfort as a born again Christian in understanding that all that God truly wants me to know He has plainly revealed in his Word. I spent more than a decade of my life as a New Ager/Gnostic going from teaching to teaching to teaching. I lost track of how many conferences I went to, books I purchased, teachers and gurus that I sought out, all in an effort to find truth. My quest for truth was sincere, but truth proved to be surprisingly elusive to attain. By the time God saved me, I was weary. I was worn out. I didn't have it in me to go after One More Thing. All I could think of at the end was that I wanted rest, just a little bit of rest, from all my fruitless searching. The Lord, in his infinite mercy, gave me rest by rescuing me out of the mire of man-made wisdom and giving me the elegant simplicity of his Word. There is such a lovely purity and clarity in knowing that I can rest securely in the knowledge that all that God wants me to know I can find in the Bible.

"Come to Me, all who are weary and heavy-laden, and I will give you rest." (Matthew 11:28)
If you are unfamiliar with the heresy of Gnosticism, please listen to Phil Johnson in this in-depth discussion of what Gnosticism is, and see if you don't come away from that talk thinking of The Harbinger.

Fiction? or Fiction Masquerading Itself as Fact?

Much like William P. Young's troublesome book The Shack, The Harbinger also has a fictional character who is teaching things that are contrary to Scripture, but which the author wants to claim as truth. Of course, when pressed on the biblical problems with the teachings, both Young and Cahn have resorted to saying, But it's only a fictional character! The problem with this is that Young and Cahn both personally believe what they have written, and are seeking to teach a wide audience of readers what they believe to be true, while hiding behind the label "Fiction."

The Truth About America's Future

The truth about America's future (and the future of all nations, for that matter), is that God holds the future in His hands. Yes, we should pray, we are commanded and exhorted to pray, but ultimately, we know that our sovereign Lord will work all things together for the good of those who love him and for HIS own purposes (Romans 8:28). And sometimes, in God's sovereign wisdom, this means that He will allow countries to fall, and nations to topple. Even, that is, nations that He has used in a mighty way to proclaim his truth to the world. I certainly do not desire to see America fall, and I pray for the leaders of this country, but at the same time, we know from the Bible that God has often used times of distress and difficulty as a means of chastening and disciplining his people.

"The kingfs heart is a stream of water in the hand of the LORD; he turns it wherever he will." (Proverbs 21:1)
When I was a fairly new Christian, I came across a resource called James Ussher's Chronological Chart of History that helped steady my thinking in this regard. James Ussher was a 17th century Anglican bishop who painstakingly charted out the bloodline from Adam and Eve to Jesus. His chart features the Biblical timeline going across the top and the corresponding world history underneath it. It's so amazing to look at this chart, and see God's hand sovereignly guiding all of human history. Below the scarlet thread of Jesus's bloodline, you see nations and kings rise and fall, rise and fall, but above it all, God's bloodline marches steadily onward toward the fulfillment of his purposes.

As Americans, we tend to think that we are so mighty, the greatest nation on earth. Well, when you look at Ussher's timeline, you realize that ALL these kingdoms once had their day in the sun, but where are they now? Egypt was once the mightiest nation in the world, known for the architectural magnificence of their awe-inspiring pyramids, and for taming the Nile River. Babylon, known for their acclaimed Hanging Gardens, and brilliant military campaigns led by Nebuchadnezzar. Rome, their amazing Roman roads and contributions to education and government. Where are they now? Some of them are still around, but do they rule the world? Looking at this chart is truly humbling, and it brings the deeper realization that all that is here will be one day be burned up and destroyed, when God himself creates a new heavens and a new earth. No government that exists here on earth - not even America - will be reigning in that Kingdom to come. But this is not bad news, this is glorious, good news, that should gladden the heart of all who truly love God and bend the knee to his sovereign will and purposes.

As far as America goes, all people everywhere are commanded to repent and believe on Christ for the forgiveness of sins, but that is not the basic message of this book. This book teaches that there is a secret message encoded in the Bible that needs to be decoded to be understood, and if we will only buy this book and decode this message, then we can bring America back. But as I wrote above, this is the heresy of Gnosticism. Our country does not need a "special" Gnostic teaching to tell us what we already know about repentance, salvation and the forgiveness of sins. In fact, I tend to agree with John MacArthur (When God Abandons A Nation), that when we look around us, we don't need to wonder, will we be judged? because we are already under judgment. First came the sexual revolution of the 60s/70s/80s (Romans 1:24), then came the homosexual revolution (Romans 1:26-27), and next comes the debased mind (Romans 1:28). We are following the trajectory laid out in Romans 1, and where we are indicates not a country that is basically good and can come back to its moral center, but a country that has been given over to its depravity. So we can churn out book after book about "taking back America" and "reclaiming America" (including Jonathan Cahn's The Harbinger), but in my opinion, America is past the tipping point. True Bible-believing Christians are in the minority in this country, and a minority is never going to reclaim a culture. We need to proclaim the gospel and snatch the few that we can from the flames.

Jonathan Cahn's Extrabiblical, Mystical Sources

"An incredible thing, it blew me away, I found it in the mystical writings, Jewish writings, of the Zohar*...." Jonathan Cahn, discussing extra-biblical, mystical writings as his sources.
* Please note that Zohar is an extrabiblical, mystical source from which the occultic and mystical Kabbalah is derived.

The Zohar Speaks

Jonathan Cahn Myspace Video

Jonathan Cahn Goes on Glenn Beck's Show To Discuss How To "Save A Nation"

Harbinger author Jonathan Cahn joined Mormon Glenn Beck for two segments of Beck's June 26/June 27 programs, and said the following things about The Harbinger:

"The Harbinger is a two and a half thousand year mystery that lies behind everything."
"The message of The Harbinger is not to condemn, it's to wake up and it's to call back. This is I believe coming out now for a reason, it's to save a nation, and to turn back."
"We can't maintain our blessings without God.....America is blessed as much as America follows God. If America does not follow God, you cannot expect the smiles of heaven."
Once again, a Gnostic teaching about a "mystery" that has to be decoded, and a call for America to turn back to God. But, why is Jonathan Cahn, who is a Christian pastor, linking with a Mormon (Glenn Beck) in order to proclaim his message? Christians and Mormons do not worship the same God, and for Cahn to appear with Mormon Glenn Beck and for the two to discuss God and America turning back to God can only serve to send a very confusing message to the world about who "God" is.

Conclusion

Does The Harbinger hold clues to helping America find her way back God? In my view, Jonathan Cahn's book is "hooking" those Christians in America who are burdened over the rising tide of immorality in our country, and who desire for America to repent and come back to the Lord. This is not a wrong or wicked desire.....it's just that, it might not play out that way, in God's sovereign plan. And this desire can become problematic, especially when Christians begin linking with non-Christians (as Jonathan Cahn did with Mormon Glenn Beck) in an effort to force those desires to come to fruition.

"Do not be bound together with unbelievers; for what partnership have righteousness and lawlessness, or what fellowship has light with darkness?" (2 Corinthians 6:14)

Why can't anybody get it right about The Harbinger?

The Harbinger controversy just gets more and more confused and crazy. Brannon Howse did another program on this today, this time alone, without Jimmy DeYoung.

But what did Brannon do? He talked mostly about the publisher of the book, names associated with the publisher, signs-and-wonders people, today's heretical prophets and apostles, trying to slam The Harbinger through guilt by association.

First, I agree with Howse about all those connections. These associations are a blot on The Harbinger and on Jonathan Cahn. And probably the worst association is Cahn's agreement to appear on the Glenn Beck show today and tomorrow. It's doubtful he could be on the show and confront Beck about his Mormonism, so I have to agree that his appearance on the show speaks against him. It puts him in the position of seeming to endorse a false religion.

However, Brannon did not go about this right. Just about the first thing he said was

"I DON'T HAVE TIME TO READ FICTION".

THE MESSAGE OF THE BOOK IS NOT FICTION, BRANNON, AND THE BOOK ITSELF IS ONLY SUPERFICIALLY OR STRUCTURALLY FICTION. AND YOU OUGHT TO KNOW THAT BY NOW.

It is not right for you not to read the book but take the time to research all kinds of things and people around the book. This is a cheap excuse, Brannon.

But now you have a real complaint about the book, and I agree as far as that goes. It bothered me that Cahn was interviewed by Sid Roth, by Jim Bakker, that it was published by Charisma House. The hype has bothered me from the beginning. And his appearing on Glenn Beck is probably going to do him in with me.

BUT, the substance of criticism of the book that Brannon has endorsed up until this point is false and remains false. On this program he quotes an unnamed "well known" evangelical saying about the book that he didn't read it through because:

"IT'S SILLY. WE ARE NOT ISRAEL. GOD HAS NOT MADE A COVENANT WITH AMERICA"

THIS is what is silly. This is the same old wrong take on the book that started the whole controversy. This is false theology, the erroneous Dispensational theology that Jimmy DeYoung has been using against the book. If you're going to pull anything from your show, Brannon, you should pull the dispensationalist criticisms of Harbinger by Jimmy DeYoung.

Besides that, Cahn does not equate America with Israel but does point out that America's earliest founders did make a covenant with God. That's simple historical fact.

Also it is ridiculous to equate the fictional character of the prophet with today's prophecy movement. Since you haven't read the book you are making indefensible accusations. This subject is confused enough without adding to it from a position of total ignorance of what the book actually says.

He's not claiming to have received revelation either as the last caller on the show said he claims.

NOTHING ABOUT THE BOOK IS "EXTRA-BIBLICAL REVELATION"

TO SAY SO IS IRRESPONSIBLE.

So far the criticisms of the book ITSELF, apart from extraneous things like its publisher and so on, ARE SIMPLY WRONG.

HOWEVER, AGAIN, all those associations Cahn has been involved with do bother me too. And if he's on Beck without making any criticism of Beck's Mormonism, if he does not come out now and clearly repudiate Beck and Sid Roth (who actually defended Todd Bentley's demon drama as "revival") then I'm not going to defend him any more either. [Later (July 2) : I believe the facts that he has never said anything that I know of to support any of the views of these people, and has to my knowledge consistently defended the true gospel of salvation, and that his motive is simply to get the message to as many people as possible, are a sufficient defense of appearing on questionable shows, and he would have to do something very clearly in the wrong, like call Glenn Beck a Christian or Bentley's or Joyner's "worship" performances Christian, for me to change my mind. Even then, oddly enough perhaps, none of this affects the content of The Harbinger itself.]

But Brannon, you are wrong not to read the book and think about the message and criticise Cahn ONLY based on these associations.

As I keep saying, the harbingers in the book could not have come about by any other power than by God. No, it can't be coincidence, and yes the equivalence with Isaiah 9:10 is uncanny. If you don't read the book you have no way to fairly assess this claim, let alone answer it, and that's the bottom line.

I'm still waiting for someone to explain those harbingers in any other way. UNTIL THEN EVERYTHING ELSE IN CRITICISM OF THE BOOK IS IRRELEVANT.